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The Pokemon Metagames

Discussion in 'Pokémon Games Discussion' started by Carmen Lopez, Dec 19, 2012.

  1. I don't think we've had topic like this since the forum died a couple of years ago. This is a general topic really: what do you think of the Pokemon Metagame? Love it and you do competitive battling a lot? Or is it just a massive turn off...

    I'm somewhere in the middle. I'm definitely not Smogon level competitive battling but I like the whole strategy and I keep up with the trends. It's just one way I get into Pokemon and it influences how I write as well. Recently I've found my competitive side waning quite a bit but I think I'll get more into it again once I get my hands on Black 2. I still need to think about whether I'm adding Genesect to my team or not, but I digress.

    Overall I like the metagame of Pokemon. Yeah, you get people who take it too seriously, but I just find it fun. My only complaint is when people get too stuck in a certain way of battling to where you can't really enjoy using other Pokemon. But that might be because I like sucky-ish Pokemon sometimes xD
  2. KoL

    KoL Expert FPS Player
    Staff Member Moderator

    Re: The Pokemon Metagame

    Depends on the meta; singles and doubles both have very different metagames, where a Pokemon can be very effective in one meta and fall flat in another. Either way I'll at least have an eye on a meta I'm interested in so I know what's popular and what I can use to beat what's popular (as well as what isn't, hopefully.)

    The differences between the two can be quite surprising sometimes. Stuff like Amoonguss, Cresselia, Hitmontop and Sableye are considered either mediocre or poor in singles, but prove to be a lot more effective in doubles. Likewise, Pokemon such as Blissey, Skarmory, Ferrothorn and Lucario find themselves very effective in singles, but tend to be outperformed in doubles due to lacking specific traits.

    I guess this topic should be named "The Pokemon Metagame(s)" instead.
  3. Re: The Pokemon Metagame

    Oooh, getting into singles versus doubles. I'm more of a singles person myself, but I think that's due to it being more real to me than doubles for some reason. Maybe it's because it's the first thing to come to mind when people think of Pokemon battling. I like trying doubles though because it's a nice change of pace and a lot easier to make teams for.

    Ha! Done
  4. Singles battle is the standard, though in Doubles, you definitely open doorways for forgotten pokemon to be able to compete without having to be under certain restrictions (see Lapras in NU tier, while competitively useful in Doubles. Same for Mantine.) The Singles tier system mostly has all-around defensive pokemon in the much lower tiers, because their opponents are dealing considerable damage to them, with little they can do in return. But, in double battles, these defensive pokemon can become supports a lot easier, especially with moves such as Helping Hand, or for the more interesting concepts, can use After You to make low tier moves go earlier (Trick Room, anyone? How about Whirlwind?) The gimmicks are endless, interesting, and just overall a fun way to confuse opponents.
  5. KoL

    KoL Expert FPS Player
    Staff Member Moderator

    Funny you should say that, since every official, competitive tournament ever hosted by The Pokemon Company International (better known as TPCi) has always been doubles format. This means that doubles is actually the standard even though most players prefer singles, which is ironic really when you think that the majority of the player base considers singles the standard, whereas the Pokemon company itself deems doubles the standard.

    (Actually it's not that ironic at all, the main reason why doubles is the standard is because 6vs6 singles matches would take far too long in a 512-man tournament, and the doubles metagame is a lot easier to balance than singles - ask Smogon.)

    Also, Lapras and Mantine are not useful in doubles, or at least not enough for anyone to bother using them over the hordes of superior Water-types out there.
  6. You'd actually be surprised at how effective my Lapras and Mantine are in battles. Mantine (in a Flying team, mind you) is an extremely effective ally to Aerodactyl, being able to Confuse Ray and Icy Wind opponents, and Helping Hand Life-Orb boosted Earthquake and Rock Slide.

    Lapras can also deal its ally (usually Politoed) minimal damage with its Surf, while completely devastating its opponents. Lapras also has access to Thunder, for pokemon that want to Water Absorb, Storm Drain, or Dry Skin its Surf. As another twist, for the probable Lightningrod holder, my Cradily has Hidden Power Ground on top of its Storm Drain. In singles, it would be highly unlikely to even hear the name Cradily, or its counterpart Armaldo. Both pokemon require the support of their teammates to be able to help to their fullest extent. I've seen minimal problems using either teammate, they get their jobs done and then some.

    Another two pokemon I use I don't see much in Singles are Cherrim and Exeggutor in my Drought team. Cherrim's Flower Gift can be awkward to work with at first, but once you get used to it, it can prove to be a powerful tool.
  7. Linkachu

    Linkachu Hero of Pizza
    Staff Member Administrator

    To be honest, I'm not quite sure where I fall in all of this. I've never been a deeply competitive person at heart but I enjoy playing my favourite video games with friends & family. One of the major ways of playing the Pokemon games with others is via head-to-head competitive battling, so once WiFi battles became a reality it was only a matter of time until I started looking into the Pokemon metagames.

    The way I view the metagames and competitive battling as a whole has changed over the years, but I've reached the point where I just accept everything for what it is. It doesn't matter which Pokemon people choose to use, whether they be very unique or commonly used, as long as I'm having fun battling with my own team. A single change in a very common moveset can throw your opponent off if they aren't prepared for it. Even when people use the exact same Pokemon with the exact same movesets, the way they battle can vary greatly. Experience is what drives the choices a player makes in match: knowing when to use a certain move, when to switch and what to switch in, when to take a risky hit or when to spend a turn powering up, etc. It's really quite amazing how the Pokemon games can be played by virtually any skill level of gamer yet are so damn strategic competitively.

    At this point I'm more interested in the doubles metagame than the singles. Doubles lends itself to faster-paced battles and ramps up the intensity from the get go because one bad turn can cost you two Pokemon. 6 on 6 Singles battles can become very drawn out, which is fun and exciting in its own way but also very daunting to engage in. That all said, some of my favourite Pokemon to battle with aren't very effective in Doubles so sometimes it's nice giving other styles of battling a go too.

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