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DPPt/HGSS Working on a competitive team

Discussion in 'The Doctor's Clinic' started by Lucario454, Jun 4, 2009.

  1. Well I'm Working on at team for few battles with my cousin this summer. He's highly adaptive to all my strategies, so after I get my team figured out, I'll need help with a strategy. Here's a few pokemon I'm pretty sure I want to use. I'm using Platinum by the way. I also have access to diamond though if that means anything to you guys.
    EDIT: More update.

    Garchomp Lv.57 Moveset:Dragon Rush
    Mild nature Dragon Rage
    Atk:173 Earthquake
    Def:119 Swords Dance
    Sp. Atk:138
    Sp. Def: 103

    Infernape Lv. 100 Moveset: Cut
    Impish Nature Grass Knot
    Atk:259 Close Combat
    Def:207 Fire Blast
    Sp. Atk:237
    Sp. Def:183
    Speed: 281

    Rhyhorn Lv.23 Moveset: Rock Blast
    Adamant nature Stomp
    Atk:66 Fury Attack
    Def:65 Scary Face

    Gallade Lv.59 Moveset: Drain Punch
    Carefull nature Psycho Cut
    Atk:170 Leaf Blade
    Def:99 Stone Edge
    Sp. Atk: 89
    Sp. Def:173

    Spiritomb Lv. 100 Moveset: Dark Pulse
    Jolly Nature Psychic
    Atk:219 Silver Wind
    Def: 251 Embargo
    Sp. Atk:197
    Sp. Def:251
    Speed: 115

    Lucario Lv. 100 Moveset: Vacuum Wave
    Brave nature Shadow Ball
    Atk: 261 Calm Mind
    Def: 169 Aura Sphere
    Sp.Atk: 261
    Sp.Def: 158
    Hold Item:petaya Berry

    A few side notes: Lucario is better now, I think.
  2. KoL

    KoL Expert FPS Player
    Staff Member Moderator

    Overall, your movesets range from OK (Rhydon) to awful (Garchomp and Infernape.) Garchomp using Dragon Rage is ridiculous, Dig is severely outstripped by Earthquake, Dragon Rush is outstripped by both Dragon Claw and Outrage, and Take Down does absolutely nothing for you. Infernape having 2 STAB Fire-type attacks is poor, and one of them being Blast Burn is even worse. Cut has to go, but since you plan on getting rid of it anyway, it's not worth really going over for now.

    Rhydon's moveset isn't too bad, even though it is just four random attacks slapped together. Its stats however are terrible compared to what they could be at Lv.100, which makes it obvious you've done no EV training at all. All your Natures are poor, and you've shown no hold items at all.

    Finally, no-one should be choosing your team members for you. That's a decision you have to make yourself. I suggest you also read this:


    That will give you the basics of making a competitive team. That's all I'm going to tell you until you make your movesets even remotely passable.
  3. Ok, where to start. Well, training them to Level100 really doesn't matter since the game automatically jacks the levels and stats to a Level100 equivalent when in link battles.

    If you really are working on a competitive team then the bad news is unfortunately that a lot of the hard work you don't want to undo will need to be undone. Otherwise you are really looking at an in-game team exclusively used for link battling.

    So I'll give it to you two ways; rebred and as is.

    So if you are willing to rebreed and EV train these guys then I have some suggestions.

    Garchomp - Jolly @ Choice Band
    Fire Punch
    Stone Edge/Rock Slide

    Infernape - Naive @ Life Orb
    Close Combat
    Nasty Plot
    Grass Knot

    Rhyperior - Relaxed @ Leftovers/Focus Sash
    Rock Slide
    Stealth Rock

    Now if you would rather not rebreed and stick to your guys as they are then my suggestions are still to teach the same moves as above. In a competitive battle you do not want to have two attacks of the same type on one guy.

    As for the rest of the team, Umbreon for a real annoying wall, Ludicolo for a bit of special sweeping, and maybe another wall (Vaporeon perhaps).
  4. KoL

    KoL Expert FPS Player
    Staff Member Moderator

    Garchomp can't learn Fire Punch. It learns Fire Fang. Also, Swords Dance Garchomp is widely considered to be its most effective set by far in OU (and is the set that led to its ban,) so if you're not battling in Ubers, then Outrage/Fire Blast/Earthquake/Swords Dance just destroys everything in sight.
  5. It can't??? The guy I fought the other day must have hacked his Garchomp in that case, thank you for telling me this KoN so I can go berate him. I thought of Sword's Dance too, but figured if you are going to be going choice band then it's rather pointless.
  6. KoL

    KoL Expert FPS Player
    Staff Member Moderator

    It's "KoL." ;)

    Swords Dance beats Choice Band with Garchomp due to the increased offensive power it provides, the move freedom it grants you (which Choice Band restricts) as well as Garchomp's surprising defensive capabilities (Base 108 HP, Base 95 Defense, Base 85 Sp.Defense) which allow it to set up in the face of anything not packing an Ice-type attack and then smash through it.
  7. Leave me alone, I just woke up :p
  8. Okay. You're right KoL. I suck at putting teams together. I'm going to rebreed Rhydon. I should of figured that out before Lv. 100 came about.
    As soon as my DS is charged, I'm also going to add three more pokemon. Expect Spiritomb to be one of them. Unless of course, it's a bad idea. I'd tell you the other two, but I'm not sure what they are yet. ;D

    Anywho, in reply to GodlessM, I'm working on fire punch for Garchomp. Just need to find that last blue shard. I taught it Swords Dance though. So Choice Band needs to be replaced I guess.Consider Earthquake done as well. I may also have a naive Infernape lying around somewhere.

    We do the battles through PBR, so we can prevent any hacking from happening during the battle. (It's happened before) I'm not sure if that means much but it may be different from what GodlessM said about the game changing the stats and all.

    I'll update the first post when I get my DS in front of me. Thanks for the help so far.
  9. KoL

    KoL Expert FPS Player
    Staff Member Moderator

    Evidently, you didn't read what I said, Lucario454. Garchomp CANNOT learn Fire Punch at all, not via Move Tutor, not by breeding, nothing.
  10. What?! *scrolls up* Dang I'm stupid! So that means I'm supposed to tech him Fire Fang right? I can't belive I spent all that time looking for the stupid shard for nothing. >:( Serves me right for being ignorant.
  11. Pretty sure PBR is the same system as Wi-Fi.
  12. Okay. I'll look into that unless you already have.

    Well updates are finally in. Hope it helps. Any Ideas on what moves to give to a level 100 Lucario that only knows Fighting moves? :p
  13. KoL

    KoL Expert FPS Player
    Staff Member Moderator

    A few changes to make:

    - Dragon Rage and Dragon Rush, as I said before, are both poor. Outrage is generally the most popular move to have in place of Dragon Rush, and anything out of Fire Fang, Flamethrower and Fire Blast can take Dragon Rage's place.

    - Infernape can swap Cut for Nasty Plot.

    - Gallade really wants Close Combat over Drain Punch. As good as Drain Punch is, its awful PP combined with its somewhat low damage essentially ruins it, making Close Combat the far superior option due to its raw damage - EVERY Gallade wants Close Combat, as a rule.

    - Spiritomb could use a set like this:

    Spiritomb @ Leftovers
    252 HP/252 SP.DEF/6 DEF

    - Spite
    - Protect
    - Rest
    - Sucker Punch/Dark Pulse

    Pressure-stall Spiritomb, designed to target enemy defensive Pokemon and drain all their PP away into nothingness. Since most defensive Pokemon tend to wield mostly Special attacks (not sure why,) your EVs have been placed to give you the best defense against such attacks. Spite steals four PP from the last move used, and any move used on Spiritomb loses two PP thanks to Pressure - this really adds up with Protect on there as well. Rest keeps you alive, and the last slot is essentially there to give you at least one offensive move - take your pick between the two.

    Also, again, your Natures need to be changed. Garchomp does best with either Lonely, Adamant or Naughty, Infernape is fine as it is, Rhydon can generally do a lot better than Bold - either the same Natures as chosen for Garchomp (NOT Lonely though) or Relaxed/Impish will do fine for him. Gallade wants either Lonely or Adamant (NOT Naughty) similar to Garchomp, and Spiritomb's Nature I've shown in the set I posted.

    As for Lucario, it can cover a lot of different roles. Show me the set thus far, and tell me what you want it to do for you (Physical sweeper, Special sweeper etc...)
  14. For Lucario try this perhaps:

    Lucario - Modest/Timid @ Choice Specs
    Aura Sphere
    Flash Cannon
    Dark Pulse

    The coverage Lucario gets works out great. Dragon Pulse is another good move if you aren't too keen on one of the above. Not many people both with steel moves on Lucario such as Flash Cannon, but I find that combined with his high SpA and STAB Flash Cannon hurts the opponent a lot.

    For the rest; I would concur with KoL that Gallade needs Close Combat. I too agree that Nasty Plot would be a good move over Cut for Infernape, however, you would need to rebreed to get it as he only learns it as a Chimchar. I use it however on my own MixNape and it really helps.
  15. KoL

    KoL Expert FPS Player
    Staff Member Moderator

    GodlessM, keep in mind Lucario's absurd versatility. Posting one set for Lucario does not do the thing justice in any way, shape or form.

    For possible sets, well, here's all of mine:

    Lucario @ Focus Sash
    252 ATK/252 SPEED/6 HP
    Inner Focus

    - Close Combat
    - ExtremeSpeed
    - Crunch
    - Swords Dance

    Looks can be deceiving - although it looks like a standard Physical sweeper, this is actually an anti-lead set (that Smogon pinched off me >_>) designed to destroy any and everything that dares dawdle by setting up entry hazards and weather effects. Close Combat is a 2HKO on almost anything that suffers neutral or more damage from it, ExtremeSpeed hits HARD for a Priority attack, and Crunch is there to get rid of any Ghost-types that stand in your way. Swords Dance is a bonus really, and grants Lucario more of a role in the team since it can do late-game sweeping as well as working as an anti-lead. The Sash is key to the anti-lead trait, and I personally believe this set sees the best Sash use of any Pokemon in OU thus far.

    For Special, there's two options for you:

    Lucario @ Petaya Berry
    252 SP.ATK/252 SPEED/6 HP
    Inner Focus

    - Aura Sphere
    - Shadow Ball
    - Vacuum Wave
    - Calm Mind

    Now, I know what you're thinking: Vacuum Wave AND Aura Sphere!? They're both Fighting-type moves! Yes, but they both serve a completely different purpose on the set, and thanks to Shadow Ball this set STILL hits everything for neutral damage. Lucario's defensive prowess is surprising for a sweeper, and if you come in at the right time you will be able to Calm Mind away and then proceed to massacre the opponent's team. Aura Sphere for STAB, Shadow Ball for Ghosts/Psychics, and Vacuum Wave is great for wiping out anyone who outspeeds you - Lucario's mediocre Speed stat MUST be circumvented in order to make the most out of it, because all the coverage in the world won't save you from something that outspeeds you.

    My Specs set went like this:

    Lucario @ Choice Specs
    252 SP.ATK/252 SPEED/6 HP
    Inner Focus

    - Aura Sphere
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Dark Pulse
    - Vacuum Wave

    Dark Pulse shines here over Shadow Ball thanks to its flinch-hax, and the fact that Heracross and Toxicroak can be hit for neutral by Dragon Pulse (they wall Fighting/Dark otherwise.) Otherwise, the set works similarly to the previous Special set, except without the required setup time with Calm Mind. Coverage is even less of a key issue here since you'd be locked into one move anyway, making widespread coverage a bit obsolete when you can't change the move you're using.
    The set, conveniently enough, is also a good counter to any Kingdra caught out of the rain.

    And finally, a mixed set:

    Lucario @ Expert Belt
    252 ATK/252 SP.ATK/6 SPEED
    Inner Focus

    - Aura Sphere
    - Dark Pulse
    - Ice Punch
    - Agility

    This set has a super-effective move for a whopping 11 out of 17 types if I remember correctly. Although Earthquake over Dark Pulse grants 12 out of 17, the extra types that EQ hits super-effectively are considerably less common than the ones hit by Dark Pulse, plus the Pulse + Agility works well due to flinch-hax. The key quirk with this set is that thanks to Agility, you don't need any EVs on Speed - one Agility and you're faster than pretty much everything that isn't Ninjask or Deoxys Speed Forme. So, use Agility, then use your immense coverage to hit your opponents where it hurts the most.

    The key to using Lucario is to cover up its biggest weakness: its mediocre Speed. Once you have a way of circumventing that issue, Lucario becomes far, far more dangerous to have to face.
  16. Well I found out that it was impossible to breed Rhydon, so I went and caught a few Rhyhorns. One had an adamant nature. I guess that's what I should train. I'm going to swap Rhydon for it and evolve it. As of now I haven't done any training so don't kill me because of the horrid moveset. Update time! ( again )
  17. Make sure you train the Rhyhorn against Shinx and Geodude mainly, they will be easy wins and get you the right EVs. Then once you have maxed on them bring him to trainer cafe to jack up his level.
  18. The trainer cafe is the place in the survival area right?
  19. The trainer cafe is the place in the survival area right?

  20. After a long time of EVing my Rhyhorn, I figured I'd post an update. I'm not completely done, but I've never EVed before so I want to make sure I'm doing it right. I'd also like to get a few moveset ideas so I'll know what to say yes to when I (ever so slowly) level up.
  21. KoL

    KoL Expert FPS Player
    Staff Member Moderator

    Here's an option for Rhydon/Rhyperior:

    Rhyperior @ Focus Sash/Sitrus Berry
    Solid Rock

    - Stealth Rock
    - Stone Edge/Rock Blast
    - Earthquake
    - Avalanche/Megahorn/Hammer Arm

    Essentially "Rock On" and attack - Stealth Rock to open up with, then start clobbering things. Stone Edge + Earthquake for STAB and good coverage intertwined, with only Flygon, Torterra and Bronzong resisting the combination from what I remember. Megahorn hits all three of these for at least neutral damage (super-effective vs Torterra,) but Avalanche is 4x super-effective vs Flygon and Torterra (but 'Zong still walls you.) Rock Blast is an option for its ability to brutalize anything that tries to use Substitute against you. Hammer Arm hits all three for neutral - take your pick. Be sure to avoid anything that might be packing a super-effective Special attack with this set, unless you plan to stuff EVs into HP and Sp.Defense (which would probably have been the better idea from the start, but either way works.)

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