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The Ultimate Team Thread

Discussion in 'Pokémon Games Discussion' started by Doctor Oak, May 18, 2005.

  1. Doctor Oak

    Staff Member Overlord

    I think this could be a fun Idea and we've got some great team-builders here to definitely make it work.

    The basic idea is that this topic is for the creation of the ULTIMATE Pokemon team.

    You can pitch in ideas, figure out what the best Pokemon are to use and so on and so forth.

    Katie can keep this post updated with the latest Team data and the eventual result will be put up onto the site - as well as used on Netbattle for testing - first against their n00bs and then against MY super-team drawn up through clinic reports and so on.

    Maybe we can even repeat the experiement on Pokeschool and have a Pokecharms Vs Pokeschool battle? ^^

    You'll therefore also need some sort of strategy finalised by the end.

    I'll start us off by saying that these Pokemon are OUT:

    Deoxys
    Mewtwo
    Mew
    Celebi
    Jirachi
    Groudon
    Kyogre
    Latios
    Latias
    Moltres
    Zapdos
    Articuno
    Ho-oh
    Lugia
    Raikou
    Entei
    Suicune

    And the team may not consist of both Skarmory and Blissey, nor featuring more than one of the following pokemon:

    Snorlax, Tyranitar, Metagross Blissey, Dragonite, Salamence, Aggron, Charizard, Blastoise, Venusaur, Meganium, Typhlosion, Feraligatr, Swampert, Blaziken, Sceptile or their pre-evolutionary forms.

    The last bit is mainly for a more unique team than you'd normally see and not an easy build of simply powerful Pokemon. We want some thinking here. ^^

    Note - This team is for Single Battles. Do not make up any Double Battle strategies for it'd just be a waste.
     
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  2. baratron

    baratron Moderator of Elder Scrolls
    Staff Member Moderator

    OK, I completely misread that... I thought you meant the team couldn't have more than one Snorlax, or more than one Blissey... And I was going to ask "Do people really have teams with multiple of the same Pokemon?"! Now I need to make a team with 6 Snorlaxes or (more likely) 6 x Salamence, just for the amusement factor.

    So we're going not only for power, but also for ingenuity? Hmmm...
     
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  3. Doctor Oak

    Staff Member Overlord

    Lol, I doubt they do as even the in-game battle events wont allow you.

    Plus it's just a really stupid thing to do. lol.
     
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  4. Linkachu

    Linkachu Hero of Pizza
    Staff Member Administrator

    I'm not really in an energetic mood right now, but I'll pitch some ideas to get things going. In other words, I'm gonna list off all the different elemental types and say which my top three or so faves to use for each are. Feel free to agree/disagree with 'em and add others (it'd be better if you did).

    Fire
    Blaziken - Nice power and type combo.
    Arcanine - Pretty good stats.
    Magmar - I haven't really trained on before (mine's still a Magby), but with such a wide range of great Sp. Attacks it can probably be very useful.

    Charizard is also great, but as I've said in the past... I don't like its 4x Rock weakness.

    Water
    Swampert - Best of the Ground/Water combo IMO
    Vaporeon - Nice high HP and Sp. Attack stat. May not have the widest movepool, but it doesn't really need one.
    Slowking - I don't know if it's just special, but mine has great stats all-around. Its movepool is also awesome.

    Ice
    Jynx - I actually haven't really trained on, but from what I've heard (and read) it can be pretty good.
    Lapras - Haven't really trained one, but it seems to be one of the better Water/Ice combos.

    We really need more Ice-types...

    Grass
    Sceptile - Looks aside, Sceptile's Speed is amazing. Its ability to learn such a wide variety of attacks is also incredibly useful. My favourite Grass-type to battle with ^^
    Ludicolo - Its type combo seems to screw a lot of people up. This is one bugger that gets under my skin... only makes me want one more.

    Exeggutor? Meganium? I wanna say Breloom, but its defence stats really aren't that great.

    Electric
    Manectric - Better stats than Raichu. It seems to be able to hold its own.
    Electabuzz - Like Magmar, it has a great movepool.
    Jolteon - Its move pool really is bad, but its got power and speed backing it.

    Lanturn? Ampharos? Haven't really used either. And I know Magneton has great stats, but its Fighting/Fire-type aren't good things. If only it had Levitate...

    Bug
    Heracross - I really love this guy. Megahorn, even with its lower accuracy, is one damn handy attack. Megahorn with STAB is simply deadly.
    Scyther - I'd rather it over Scizor for its Flying-half, but that's mainly because mine is usually a sword-dancer (SD + Aerial Ace + STAB = w00t). Scizor is probably the better Pokemon... Maybe...
    Venomoth - I like this thing. Nice ability, and Signal Beam is a fairly good attack. I haven't used one before, though, so I don't really know how great it is.
    Ninjask - Great ability.

    Poison
    Crobat - I loved training this thing. Nice and fast with a great attack-stat. Sludge Bomb r0xx0r.
    Venusaur - Probably one of the better Grass/Poison combos. Still rather Sceptile for Grass, tho.

    Muk? Seviper? Weezing? And various others... Haven't trained many poison types. Crobat is my baby.

    Rock
    Tyranitar - Sheer powerhouse.
    Rhyhorn - Megahorn-ness.
    Golem - If it lives long enough, it can do some damage.
    Aerodactyl - Yesss

    ... I love a lot of Rock-types ^^; Many, many great ones to choose from. It really depends which type combos you want.

    Ground
    Aside from Swampert and the Rock/Ground combos listed above?

    Camerupt - I only trained it once but found it pretty useful. I'd use it again ^^
    Sandslash - Nice Sword Dancer.
    Nidoking - Damn... Forgot this guy for Poison-types. Nidoking has a great Ability, nice power, and learns Megahorn by level. Who doesn't love that?

    Flying
    Xatu/Sharmory - Not the best attack-stats, but they look like they could be useful. Need Drill Peck bred on, tho.
    Swellow - Guts is awesome for Double Battles.

    Farfetch'd? Dodrio? Never really trained 'em. Look to the ones above, and the ones soon to come. There are a lot of great Flying-types.

    Fighting
    Hariyama - 'Cause this chubby bastard with Guts kicked in can do some serious damage.
    Machamp - Haven't seriously trained one yet, but just from battling it I know it can do some damage.
    The Himon's - All pretty decent. Haven't really trained any of 'em myself, though.

    And again, look to other types (Blaziken, Heracross, etc.)

    Steel
    Steelix - I am mighty, hear me rawr.
    Aggron - Also good as a Rock-type.
    Metagross - Heck. Yeah! Meteor Mash owns your soul.

    Dragon
    Salamence - Ooooh yeah. A beast. A fast beast.
    Dragonite - Barney has power in some places Salamence doesn't (like TMs), but I'd rather Salamence's speed.
    Flygon - Also good for Ground-types. Basically an all-TM/Eggmove Pokemon but still good ^^

    Dark
    Absol - Great Pokemon, with or without Dark-type moves.
    Houndoom - w00f

    Psychic
    Espeon - I love its high Sp. stat.
    Alakazam - Nice move pool, but very overused.
    Wobbufett - Wobbaaa!

    And again, others are above.

    Ghost
    Gengar - It's really not that great for a Ghost-type, but its stats are pretty great. I had to throw it in somewhere.

    And I haven't trained any of the other Ghosties.

    Normal
    Snorlax - Can't deny that one.
    Zangoose - Some people complain about its move pool, but I loved training this thing.
    Porygon2 - Maybe? Porygon always seemed annoying to battle. Porygon2 would just be moreso then.
    Tauros - Can be a very big pain in the behind. Nice power and speed.
    Slaking - Switch its Nature on Double Battle and you've got one crazy monkey on your hands.


    And that didn't take long x.x
    Yeah, I'm sure I missed some obvious ones, but hey - that's what you guys are for :p :wink:
     
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  5. Doctor Oak

    Staff Member Overlord

    I'd reccomend not overlooking Pidgeot for flying - classics are always the best. It's fast, snappy and effective - training one again in FR/LG was great.

    Not that my influences should be taken as "YOU MUST DO THIS!", i'm just chipping in a little.
     
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  6. StellarWind Elsydeon

    StellarWind Elsydeon Armblades Ascendant
    Staff Member Administrator

    Hey, Gary, you forgot Raikou, Entei and Suicune. :p I think you missed three legends in the What-PokeMon-Are-Out. ;P

    But yeah. Legendaries are cheap. Good riddant×™.

    Lapras is a freakin' GOD. Give it the Mirai Moveset (T-Bolt, Surf, Ice Beam and Confuse Ray) and you've got a killer on your hands. XD. ^_^;

    I'm not going to make any suggestions, though, as I've pretty much found out that a small, focused team of three Hoenn PokeMon - none of which is usually considered overpowered(!) - can basically kick the collective tails of just about anything out there. ^^;
     
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  7. Doctor Oak

    Staff Member Overlord

    Well noted Stel. Lol. I knew there was something missing, but meh - that's what you get for writing this stuff up late at night. ^^
     
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  8. Yoshimitsu

    Former Moderator

    Medicham! I love that thing. It can be used for a sweeper pokemon easily. Give it Calm Mind and the three element punches and there you have one great special sweeper. Give it Bulk Up, Rockslide, High Jump Kick and Shadow Ball and you have a physical sweeper.

    Or ignore me completely. Meh ^_^
     
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  9. Linkachu

    Linkachu Hero of Pizza
    Staff Member Administrator

    So, we have two possible movesets for Pokemon... Anyone want to take a stab at a team or two of six?

    Don't need movesets yet if you can't think of them. Just pick six Pokemon that you think would make a solid team - "solid" being the keyword. Don't pick a certain six just because they're favourites :p

    I'll try thinking some stuff up later on. For now I'm off to watch Buffy ^^
     
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  10. Doctor Oak

    Staff Member Overlord

    Good to know she has her priorities straight, eh? :p
     
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  11. baratron

    baratron Moderator of Elder Scrolls
    Staff Member Moderator

    OK, I'm at home with a bit of time on my hands & feeling too ill to do any of the housework that needs doing, so I'll give some ideas too... Disclaimer: I am not an expert and may be talking rubbish :D.

    I'm going to completely avoid Snorlax, Tyranitar, Metagross, Blissey, Dragonite, Salamence, Aggron, Charizard, Blastoise, Venusaur, Meganium, Typhlosion, Feraligatr, Swampert, Blaziken and Sceptile for now. (Wot no Gyarados? :shock:). I've coded Special Attack moves with a *. Pokemon types are in brackets after their name to remind you, items after @, abilities are ~, listed when there's a choice. I'm assuming you can only use one of each type of item.

    For Special Sweepers (high Sp Atk + Speed), I'd choose Alakazam or Starmie. Both with Modest ability (-Atk + Sp Atk):
    Alakazam (PSYCHIC) @ Focus Band
    ~Synchronize~
    *Fire Punch - FIRE
    *Ice Punch - ICE
    *Thunderpunch - ELECTRIC
    *Psychic - PSYCHIC + STAB

    If you think Alakazam is too over-used, try:
    Starmie (WATER/PSYCHIC) @ King's Rock
    ~Natural Cure~
    *Thunderbolt - ELECTRIC
    *Ice Beam - ICE
    *Psychic - PSYCHIC + STAB
    *Surf - WATER + STAB

    This is a NICE moveset. Thunderbolt & Ice Beam are higher power than Alakazam's Thunderpunch & Ice Punch. Also it's useful having 2 x STAB moves. The lack of Fire moves is annoying, but can be made up elsewhere.

    Alternatively, for the real underused pkmn, go for:
    Castform (NORMAL, but not really) @ Focus Band
    Sunny Day
    Rain Dance
    Hail
    (*)Weather Ball

    Weather Ball becomes a Special move of the same type as the current weather. In Hail, it has power 150. When Sunny Day or Rain Dance are active, it has the staggering power of 225!
    (Base power 50
    x 2 because a weather effect is in play
    x 1.5 Sunny Day/Rain Dance same-type bonus
    x 1.5 STAB as Castform changes type to match the weather = 225)

    Castform has lousy Def & Sp Def, but so do all of those 3. So they'd all need some defensive EVs. Either that, or rely on Speed and Sp Atk so that they 1 hit KO the opposition. I've found Focus Band quite helpful with vulnerable Pokemon.

    I agree with Linkachu that we should include either Heracross or Scizor. Either would make a good Physical Sweeper. I guess they want Adamant nature (+Atk -Sp Atk)

    Heracross (BUG/FIGHTING) @ Shell Bell
    ~Swarm~ or ~Guts~, either would do
    Megahorn - Powerful BUG attack + STAB. Powers up even more if Heracross has Swarm ability
    Substitute
    Focus Punch - FIGHTING + STAB

    so Heracross can use the Substitute + Focus Punch combination as beloved of many Snorlaxes (why ditch a perfectly good combination just 'cos the usual wielders are overused? :p).

    If you go for Guts ability, the obvious fourth move would be Facade. If not, Rock Slide would fix that pesky 4 x vulnerability to Flying. Or you could go for Earthquake, just because.

    Scizor (BUG/STEEL) @ Shell Bell
    Slash - NORMAL - 30% critical hit rate
    Metal Claw - STEEL + STAB - 10% chance of raising Attack one stage. I prefer it to Steel Wing
    Silver Wind - BUG + STAB + Swarm boost - 10% chance of raising ALL stats. Basically the Bug-type Ancientpower.
    Swords Dance / Iron Defence - depending on if you want to raise Attack or Defence 2 stages. Or choose a 4th attack.

    I also think we should use Ludicolo, because not only does its type combo screw people up, it has a COLOSSAL range of attack types. I've decided my Emerald team will include a Ludicolo, but I have no idea what moveset to go for yet. A typical HP-eater would be something like:

    Ludicolo (WATER/GRASS) @ Leftovers
    ~Rain Dish~ (restores HP every move it's raining)
    + Calm or Relaxed nature (Calm -Atk + Sp Def, Relaxed +Def -Speed) +
    Rain Dance
    *Giga Drain - GRASS + STAB

    then add:
    *Hydro Pump - WATER + STAB + Rain Dance boost

    Hydro Pump would multiply in power by STAB and Rain Dance to have the staggering power of 270. Alternatively, if you want more accuracy, Surf would go up to 213.75 (!). Shame it can't use Thunder, as that would also go splendidly with Rain Dance ;). Ah well.

    A suitable fourth move could be Thunderpunch (Super Effective against Flying) or Fire Punch (Super Effective against Bug - and a FIRE type move would be even more unexpected to the opponent already reeling from finding Ludicolo is part-Water).

    I like Crobat as well. Adamant, Impish, Careful or Jolly nature (I dunno which one).

    Crobat (POISON/FLYING) @ Lum Berry?
    Confuse Ray
    Shadow Ball - GHOST
    Poison Fang - POISON (power 50 + STAB, & it's Toxic-type poison). Or Sludge Bomb, if you prefer.
    Aerial Ace - FLYING + STAB + Never miss

    So to summarise:
    1. Starmie / Alakazam / Castform
    2. Heracross / Scizor
    3. Ludicolo
    4. Crobat
    5+6. 2 others

    Actually, I'm trying to justify including both Heracross and Scizor, but I don't think we really want two Bug-types...

    One more idea: if you want a Dragon-type and want to avoid Salamence and Dragonite, you could go for Flygon:
    Flygon (GROUND/DRAGON)
    dunno about nature
    *Crunch - DARK
    *Dragon Claw - DRAGON + STAB
    Earthquake - GROUND + STAB - because it gets STAB?
    *Flamethrower / Fire Blast - FIRE to try to counteract that pesky Ice problem?
    but I don't know how feasible this is. In general I try to avoid pkmn that are 4 x vulnerable to anything - I ended up dropping Magneton and Gyarados for that reason. Scizor is the only exception in my current teams, iirc.
     
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  12. Linkachu

    Linkachu Hero of Pizza
    Staff Member Administrator

    Damn, I forgot Starmie? Silly me. It's one of the better Water-types, too ^_^; (Still haven't retrained one this Gen, though)

    I really love Heracross so I'd be all for it making a team like this. Great on both the Bug/Fighting fronts, except that its 4x weakness to flyers can be a bit harsh. Rock Slide will take them and Fire-types out, just not as effectively as EQ would get the Fire-types...

    Not sure about Substitute, but that's probably just my personal perference. I know it's very useful but I loathe the attack :p

    I like Ludicolo (T-Punch could work) and Crobat aswell (I do prefer Sludge Bomb over Poison Fang because it'll take the foe down quicker), and Flygon is a good replacement for the oober Dragons. Gives you a Pokemon with EQ STAB, too :wink:

    If I were you picking from your choices I'd probably take Starmie over Alakazam/Castform and Heracross over Scizor. I'll leave the Starmie/Alakazam debate open for others, tho. I'm only saying this on a whim and not really checking out stats.
     
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  13. Swampert! The most awesome starter. Of all time.

    Swampert (WATER/GROUND) @ Leftovers
    ~Torrent~
    No idea of the nature.

    - Counter
    - Mirror Coat
    - Surf
    - Earthquake

    Meh, kinda dependant on your guessing skills :p still works good though.


    Swampert (WATER/GROUND) @ Leftovers
    ~Torrent~
    No idea of the nature.

    - Earthquake
    - Surf
    - Rest/Roar
    - Ice Beam/Rock Slide

    EQ and Surf get STAB which is always fun, Roar helps get rid of unwanted foes. Rest is fine too but personally I prefer Roar, I hear some people also use Refresh so meh, it's really down to preference. Ice beam and Rock slide are self explanitory (but I'll explain anyway :p) They help get rid of Flying types, Grass types and so on. Ice beam also helps against dragons which Swampert could have trouble with since the other moves are kind of crappy against them.
     
  14. Nemesis

    Former Administrator

    I always find this moveset works for Ludicolo-

    Ludicolo@Leftovers
    RainDish ability
    Toxic
    Rain Dance
    Leech Seed
    (Water move, Dive works as a staller to drain more with Toxic/Leech seed)

    Obviously more an annoyer than going full out with power, but always seems to work for me. Mega/Giga Drain could be taked on at the end too.

    I also use a spiking Omastar, with Swift Swim and Rain Dance, which if set up right gives Ludicolo a bit of a headstart.
     
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  15. i'm reviving this topic, but....

    shuckle @ leftovers
    toxic
    double team/wrap
    rest
    sleeptalk (?)

    this guy is the original wall. max of 600 or so in each of the defenses, with a beneficial nature.

    dragonite @ leftovers
    t-bolt
    flamethrower
    dragon claw
    dragon dance

    the first 2 moves are to get rid of ice types, and water/ice types. fortunately they cover most of the other types as well. dragon claw for those other pesky dragons, and dragon dance for obvious reasons. is there a special atk equivalent of dragon dance in DP?
    maybe that will be a better alternative for this special sweeper dragonite. but thankfully the dragon claw takes advantage of the spec/phys split in dp.


    soo many other combinations. soo little time. and maybe i should start a new topic like this? who knows.
     

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