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DPPt/HGSS Building a team for Platinum

Discussion in 'The Doctor's Clinic' started by Moose, Jun 23, 2009.

  1. So, yeah. It's been such a long time since I actually sat down and decided to build a party that is actually tactical and well-worth fighting.

    Regardless, I've been trying to figure out what kind of party to build, and I decided on a basic beat-down party of multiple elements.

    Levels do not concern me-- yet. I'm only on the 4th gym, so my pokemon aren't at their final evolution forms yet.

    I intend on:
    Gardevoir, Blaziken, Roserade, Luxray, Empoleon, and Flygon.

    Are there better suggestions on Pokemon or suggestions on the movesets for each pokemon?
     
  2. KoL

    KoL FPS Guy
    Staff Member Moderator

    I'll assume you're planning competitive after you've beaten the game.

    Your team is OK, although focusing 100% on attack isn't too advisable, since if the opponent seizes control of the battle, six sweepers aren't likely to get that control back. You can still go mostly for a beat-down style team, only with four sweepers, and one physical and one special defender. That way, you have some measure of defense and control within the team whilst still retaining the mostly offense-oriented theme.

    What movesets/natures/items do you have planned thus far? It'll be easier to give you advice if we know what you have available to you.
     
  3. So far;

    Gardevoir (Hardy Nature) [Ab: Synchronize] @ Odd Incense
    Calm Mind, Psychic, Magical Leaf, Protect

    Blaziken (Brave Nature) [Ab: Blaze] @ Focus Band
    Flamethrower, Shadow Claw, Focus Blast, Close Combat

    Roserade (Quiet Nature) [Ab: Natural Cure] @ Big Root
    Giga Drain, Razor Leaf, Stun Spore, Leech Seed

    Luxray (Lonely Nature) [Ab: Rivalry] @ Magnet
    Crunch, Thunderbolt, Iron Tail, Thunder Fang

    Flygon (Brave Nature) [Ab: Hyper Cutter] @ Leftovers
    Earthquake, Hyper Beam, Fly, Crunch

    Empoleon (Bold Nature) [Ab: Torrent]
    Hydro Pump, Brine, Aerial Ace, Ice Beam
     
  4. Off the top of my head:

    -the natures look so random that I'm questioning the assumption that you'll use it to battle other players.

    -items that only boost one type of attack (electric, fire, etc) are adequate placeholders if you don't have access to better stuff yet, but once you do, aughno.

    -get some type coverage on that Roserade! Pick whichever grass move is better for what you want to accomplish-- do you prefer power over the ability to replenish yourself a little/a lot?-- and what the stats allow for: Roserade has a phenomenally better special attack than attack. Even factoring in natures/IVs/EVs, you couldn't make its attack stat too much higher than it's sp. attack, so ideally any flat out "I use this to hurt people" move would rely on sp. attack.

    -Pick Thunderbolt, or Thunder Fang.

    -Fly is generally a no-no for competitive battles. It's mandatory for getting around the world, yes, but sucks when your opponent is smart enough to make predictions as to who you're attacking with it. (It's not very strong, either....)

    -Hydro Pump, or Brine. Surf might be better than either, so consider that, too.


    If you're not going to use this team against other players, you can get away with a lot more, but the general guidelines are good.
     
  5. Honestly I can't even tell the difference between any of the natures.

    Well, as of I now, I have 5 badges. So once I can more access, I'll be sure to.

    And replace the others with what? I don't have much access to the vastness of TMs yet.

    For the rest, I'll look into it.
     
  6. - http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Nature
    A free +10% to one of your stats if you play your cards right, pretty much.

    -I wasn't sure if you had access to another game/save file that could feed you Battle Tower items like Muscle Bands or Scope Lenses. Obviously, if you can't, don't worry about it.

    -Just glancing at Roselia's section on Psypoke: Magical Leaf has better accuracy, more power, and uses the Sp. Attack stat, making it a good replacement for Razor Leaf, plus is learned by level-up (Roselia learns at 19); Substitute could also be a possibility if you'd rather go with a drain/annoyance sort of approach. (TM90, 2000 game coins at the Game Corner.)


    I think you picked a few of the favored heavy-hitters, but a little clarification as to what you'd like to do would be helpful. Do you want to use this team to go up against other players? Or do you just want to beat the game? (I'd also highly suggest reading the sticky about competitive basics if you'd like to go that route, it's extremely helpful.)
     
    #6 Wobbegong, Jun 24, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 27, 2014
  7. Though looking through this, wouldn't going for a nature that has no effect on stat growth be the best choice, that way there is no decrement?

    Sounds about right, I'll take that advice.

    Well, this team should be able to beat the game obviously as I haven't finished it, but I do plan on using it online and during battles with other trainers. Should I recatch some of the Pokemon I already have, or should I first beat the game so I can access to everything, and then hatch all my Pokemon with select natures and abilities?
     
    #7 Moose, Jun 24, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 27, 2014
  8. -Ideally, your nature is +10% to the stat you'll rely on most, and -10% to the one you care about least. For instance, if every attack your pokemon has is physical, your Sp. Attack stat it worthless; if your pokemon is built assuming that you'll always go last, you can probably nudge its Speed downwards. Etc.

    -I'm pretty sure at 5 badges in that you have access to all the basic tools to nature/EV/IV breed up the ultimate pokemon. On the other hand, it'll generally be (much) more difficult than if you wait and do it later. So that's your call.
     
  9. Ok, taking the suggestions given, how does a team like this sound?

    Gardevoir [Modest] (Special Sweeper)
    Lucky Chant, Calm Mind, Psychic, Signal Beam

    Flygon [Adamant] (Attacker)
    Fire Punch, Earthquake, Steel Wing, Dragon Claw

    Empoleon [Calm] (Mix'd SpDefend and SpAttack)
    ??, ??, ??, Surf

    Weavile [Jolly] (Speed Attack Sweeper)
    ??, ??, ??, Ice Beam

    Roserade [Calm] (Status + SpAttack)
    Magical Leaf, Stun Spore, ??, ??

    Dusknoir [Adamant or Jolly] (Tank)
    ??, ??, ??, Shadow Claw
     
  10. Stark

    Friend Code:
    5284-2169-6918
    Gardevoir... I'd say drop Lucky Chat and Signal Beam for Ice Beam and Thunderbolt. Generic, but it works. Possibly replace Ice Beam or Thunderbolt for Will-o-Wisp so Physical attackers are deterred.

    Flygon: Fire Punch is great, covers your Ice weakness. EQ for STAB, good. Dragon Claw is nice, possibly swap for Outrage or maybe even Draco Meteor but its good. I'd also take Stone Edge or U-Turn over Steel Wing as well.

    Your Weavile never ever wants Ice Beam. Its special attack is abysmal so you want Ice Punch or Ice Shard all the time. Swords Dance, Night Slash and Brick Break for the other three moves would make it a solid set.

    Interesting that you want a Special Defender, my Empoleon is also like that except he's based around Physical moves. As for yours, I'd say Surf + Ice Beam is a no-brainer. Grass Knot could be thrown in as well. That's about all he has for Special moves... he does have Signal Beam as well, though you could have something like Stealth Rock snuck in maybe.

    Roserade... you definitely want Leaf Storm (over Magical Leaf). Its so powerful on a strong Roserade, I have one myself and it works a treat. If you dislike the Stat drop, you can take Energy Ball for a solid alternative. Other moves... you mentioned status so Sleep Powder is an obvious choice, as is Stun Spore. To fill the set off, you have options like a good Hidden Power, Shadow Ball or a STAB'd Sludge Bomb.

    Finally, Dusknoir. If you want a Tank, you want to be able to take hits. Impish nature instead of your suggestions there, and you'd want Pain Split for definite to keep your health up. As for the rest... I have no idea :p
     
  11. KoL

    KoL FPS Guy
    Staff Member Moderator

    Gardevoir can't learn Ice Beam, ever. Shadow Ball, Focus Blast and Energy Ball are viable options though.

    Fire Blast works well on Flygon, since it allows you to fight off Steelix, Forretress and Skarmory easily. Forretress will still suffer massive damage from Fire Punch, but Skarmory and Steelix will shrug it off with ease. They won't have the same luck trying to shrug off Fire Blast.

    Roserade works well with Choice Specs - STAB Leaf Storm already hits very hard, but a 50% boost from Choice Specs will make it outright deadly. Since Choice Item users tend to switch in and out a lot anyway, the Sp.Attack drop won't affect you too much, and two Leaf Storms should be enough to slay anything that doesn't resist it with this (or anything that doesn't wield an enormous Sp.Defense stat.)

    As for Dusknoir, this set is comedy:

    Dusknoir @ Leftovers
    Careful
    Pressure

    - Night Shade
    - Rest
    - Spite
    - Protect

    Designed to attack the opponent's PP and whittle it down to zero. This set works well on anything that would try to stall you - since a lot of your Pokemon are offense-oriented, this can help you break down the walls that would otherwise slow you down. Alternating between Protect and Spite will quickly devour your opponent's PP, while Rest keeps your HP up - since the set attacks PP and not HP, you're essentially still active whilst asleep if your opponent keeps attacking. Night Shade is to avoid Taunt, and to grant consistent damage against an opposing staller, which this set is designed to face.

    As for when to start sorting this out, I'd say definitely beat the game first, then build the team. You will not have nearly enough resources available to you for this mid-game unless you have a second cartridge to trade TMs and items from, and even then you don't really need to rush this. I'd beat the game first and then worry about competitive battling.
     
  12. Gardevoir cannot learn Ice Beam, and Lucky Chant will prevent critical hits which is generically a good thing. Signal Beam CAN be replaced, but people will expect that.

    [quote author=LoN link=topic=6389.msg109673#msg109673 date=1245916333]Flygon: Fire Punch is great, covers your Ice weakness. EQ for STAB, good. Dragon Claw is nice, possibly swap for Outrage or maybe even Draco Meteor but its good. I'd also take Stone Edge or U-Turn over Steel Wing as well.[/quote]

    Draco Meteor is a special attack, making it a bit useless for this Flygon. Outrage would be a good swap, but then that would lock me into it and confuse me at the end, leaving me open to ice attacks.

    [quote author=Moosechu link=topic=6389.msg109642#msg109642 date=1245897577]Your Weavile never ever wants Ice Beam. Its special attack is abysmal so you want Ice Punch or Ice Shard all the time. Swords Dance, Night Slash and Brick Break for the other three moves would make it a solid set.[/quote]

    Swords Dance isn't useful enough as Weavile can't take too many punches. The other moves are very good suggestions though.

    [quote author=LoN link=topic=6389.msg109673#msg109673 date=1245916333]Interesting that you want a Special Defender, my Empoleon is also like that except he's based around Physical moves. As for yours, I'd say Surf + Ice Beam is a no-brainer. Grass Knot could be thrown in as well. That's about all he has for Special moves... he does have Signal Beam as well, though you could have something like Stealth Rock snuck in maybe.[/quote]

    I've decided on this move-set: Ice Beam, Hydro Pump, Iron Defense, and Rest.

    The reason for Hydro Pump instead of Surf is because it's more powerful, and this Empoleon isn't intended on being a sweeper.

    [quote author=LoN link=topic=6389.msg109673#msg109673 date=1245916333]Roserade... you definitely want Leaf Storm (over Magical Leaf). Its so powerful on a strong Roserade, I have one myself and it works a treat. If you dislike the Stat drop, you can take Energy Ball for a solid alternative. Other moves... you mentioned status so Sleep Powder is an obvious choice, as is Stun Spore. To fill the set off, you have options like a good Hidden Power, Shadow Ball or a STAB'd Sludge Bomb.[/quote]

    Leaf Storm is an egg move, and Hidden Power would take forever to breed.

    I've decided on these moves: Worry Seed, Toxic, Leech Seed, Giga Drain

    [quote author=LoN link=topic=6389.msg109673#msg109673 date=1245916333]Finally, Dusknoir. If you want a Tank, you want to be able to take hits. Impish nature instead of your suggestions there, and you'd want Pain Split for definite to keep your health up. As for the rest... I have no idea :p
    [/quote]

    Thanks for the nature suggestion. How's this for a moveset? Rest, Spite, Will-O-Wisp, Payback

    [quote author=King of Lucario link=topic=6389.msg109675#msg109675 date=1245920957]Fire Blast works well on Flygon, since it allows you to fight off Steelix, Forretress and Skarmory easily. Forretress will still suffer massive damage from Fire Punch, but Skarmory and Steelix will shrug it off with ease. They won't have the same luck trying to shrug off Fire Blast.[/quote]

    The only problem is that this Flygon's stats are in physical attacks and not in special attacks, so Fire Punch would be the only alternative physical-fire attack.
     
  13. KoL

    KoL FPS Guy
    Staff Member Moderator

    Untrained Fire Blast > Trained Fire Punch on the mentioned three targets. Their Defense vastly outstrips your Attack regardless of EVs - Fire Blast wins here hands down as long as you don't carry a Nature that is dropping your Sp.Attack.

    As far as Weavile is concerned, well...Focus Sash + Swords Dance = problem solved. Good prediction helps even more - boosting up with Swords Dance on Weavile shouldn't be problematic if you know what you're doing.

    As for your proposed Roserade set...it's flawed - very flawed. Any Grass/Poison-type will decimate it, and removing the negative effects from it can be solved easily by switching out, and you lack any means of exploiting said switch-outs. Plus, Roserade's defenses are nowhere near good enough to let it set up on something like that.

    Finally, Rest + Spite should stay on a set that revolves around PP stalling only, not one that goes halfway and then moves to Will-O-Wisp and Payback, since you generally have much better options than Rest and Spite on a set that isn't relying on PP attacking.
     

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